Gordon W Davies

Darin wrote: It is not correct to impose “standard” distances in the SSI or RRS, as each class, location and race day is different. Training of race teams (and skippers) is more appropriate. I would agree that it is inappropriate to set exact distances. The IRSA text says: Courses will be set so that sail numbers of boats at the marks are clearly visible from the nearest part of the control area. Based on experience, in good light conditions, this means that marks will be laid no further than 70m from the control area. This sets out a desired outcome - sail numbers should be visible at marks, and transmits experience gained at a large number of events. If this text applies, competitors would expect marks to be laid within their field of vision. If the RO decides to lay the marks further away he should explain why he has taken that decision. Brad's points suggestion is interesting. Repeated infringements could result in a warning, followed by an aggravated penalty for the next infringement.

Austin, I agree with you. Please bear with me as I run through my argument on this point -some may consider this to be more of a rant than anything else, for which I make no apologies. I would argue that setting of courses at ever increasing distance is creating a serious issue for all competition, from club racing to World Championships. The Call Book for Radio Sailing states: In radio sailing the boat and the competitor controlling her are usually separated by some, possibly significant distance. The competitor may not be well placed to view any incident and to rapidly analyse the relative speed, angle and distance between the boats. Therefore, interpretations of the rules should be appropriate to the conditions and take account of these limitations. (Incidentally this is also why umpires and observers should remain in the control area, so that their reading of any incident takes into account these limitations). The major limitation is the human eye itself. For ordinary mortals, according to commonly available charts, that all seem to agree, the maximum readable distance for 4 inch high letters is 150 feet ( 45.7 metres). Under RRS App G, modified for radio sailing in Appendix E) the maximum size for sail numbers is 110mm (4.33 inches). For some reason this limit does not seem to apply to race officers, who all appear to possess super-human vision! Experience suggests that radio sailors have good vision as repeated testing has shown that we can read sail numbers at about 70m (measures made using golf range finders at many events). This may just mean that sailors with average or less that average vision abandon the sport of radio sailing. Once sail numbers are not readable then other aspects of vision also rapidly deteriorate: judgement of lay lines, collision courses, relative positions between boats (gauge, overlaps when boats are sailing towards or away from the viewer). It is clear to all sailors that incidents at the windward mark increase greatly the further away the marks are; The resulting chaos, with rafts of boats drifting slowly downwind as several angry (mainly middle aged) men exchange pleasantries on the bank is a sorry spectacle that can only bring the sport of radio sailing into disrepute. I would argue that it is the task of the race committee to respect the real limitations of the human eye when setting the course. It is unacceptable to expect sailors, observers and umpires to be presented with a course that does not allow them to compete or officate correctly. According to the WS Race Management Manual: The role of the Course Race Officer is an on the water manager, (...) another important role is to make decisions to ensure the fairness and safety of the competition. I would argue that a key decision to ensure the fairness of a competition is to set a course on which the competitors can view their boat and analyse relative speed, angle and distance between the boats. For this reason IRSA has written into the update (soon to be published) to the IRSA Race Management Policies Courses will be set so that sail numbers of boats at the marks are clearly visible from the nearest part of the control area. Based on experience, in good light conditions, this means that marks will be laid no further than 70m from the control area. The question remains, how can sailors insist that race officers set course that are fair to the average competitor. One way is to influence the clubs who organise events. RRS 90.1 states: The race committee shall conduct races as directed by the organising authority and as required by the rules. A club has every right to direct the race officer it appoints to set courses with marks no more that 70m from the bank. The MYA could stipulate that courses for all ranking events courses should be set within this limit. This may require some imaginative race management. One solution, inspired by observing racing at Fleetwood, is to limit the sailing area. On a long narrow pond like Fleetwood, suitable courses can be laid with wind up to 45° to the axis of the lake. On an unrestricted sailing area with a 100m long control area, at 45° the windward mark would be set about 110 m offshore. I look forward to your comments.

Thank you John for your answer. Some comments: 1. Course setting is also a factor. I would argue that the biggest cause of multiple pile ups, especially at the windward mark, is simply the distance between the control area and the mark. The human eye has its limits. Beyond a certain distance it becomes difficult, if not impossible to judge: - laylines -distances and angles between boats, this judging if boats are on a collision course - distances between boats that are overlapped. The most useful indicator that marks are too far away is that neither competitors nor observers can read sail numbers. For some mysterious reason all race officers are possessed of superhuman vision. Personally, I believe that a race committee has an obligation to set a course that offers competitors fair sailing. Setting marks too far away is unfair. A race committee is required to run racing as directed by the organising committee (RRS 90). The OA has every right to direct a racing committee to lay marks within the comfortable range of vision for competitors. 2. look at the team racing version of Rule 18. Don’t know how well it works but at least it’s simple. In reality, there is little difference, team racing deletes RRS 18.4 (which does not apply at a gate anyway) and modifies, without really simplifying RRS 18.2(a). The match racing rule at marks is simple - but that would mean that at a windward mark to be left to port the boat approaching the mark on port tack would be entitled to mark room from the time they enter the zone until she leaves it. Simple, effective but somewhat radical 3. people don’t know the rules! I wwould agree. The only answer is education. The RYA had a club rules adviser system that meant that at least one person in the club had been taught the rules, and could advise other members. Perhaps this scheme could be revised for radio sailing. 4. RRS 13 The text of rule 13 very carefully avoids using the word tacking. A boat changes tack when it passes head to wind (Definition), however from the time the boat passes head to wind until she is on a close-hauled course (not necessarily with the sails full) she must keep clear. If when she does reach a close-hauled course she acquires right of way over another boat she must initially give the other boat room to keep clear. 5. Rule 18.3 This rule does not really work in radio sailing - especially when the the marks are beyond the range of the human eye to make fine judgements. It is a common interpretation to consider that a boat that arrives on port when boats are arriving on starboard, and causes a pile-up, should be penalised for a breach of RRS 2 Fair Sailing. Use of the match racing rule would possibly help, but I am not convinced that the radio sailing community is ready to allow port tackers to round the mark unencumbered. IRSA submitted a proposal that a boat that enters the zone on port should give mark-room to a boat that enters the zone on starboard. This was put to one side by WS but could be revived. 6 Cutting Inside while Mark Rounding WS Case 63 states that when space is made available to a boat that is not entitled to it, she may, at her own risk, take advantage of the space. This is a common occurence in radio sailing (dare I mention distance from the control area to the mark again!) when a boat overruns the mark. A following boat may take advantage of the space made available. One issue is that the leading boat is no longer sailing within the mark-room to which she is entitled, so is no longer exonerated if she breaks RR2 10-13 or 15-16, so cannot manouevre freely to round the mark. Another common scenario is a leading boat does a tight rounding and as she hardens up she slips sideways, leaving a gap to windward for a smart sailor to sail into. 7 RRS 17; There is an argument that we could do without RRS17, as the boat becoming overlapped from astern is bound by both rules 15 and 16. Proper course is not easy to judge (except at the offset mark, when it obvious if a boat is reaching away from the mark rather than bearing away on to a run.

You initially finished when when any part of of the hull crossed the finishing line from the course side (Definition). You are racing until you clear the finishing line and marks.(Definition). This means until no part of the hull, crew or equipment is on the line and no mark is influencing your choice of course (Case 127) You touched a finishing mark while racing and broke RRS 31. This means that: - you have not finished (Definition) - you should immediately get well clear of other boats and promptly take a One Turn Penalty (RRS E4.3) - you can take the penalty anywhere (preferably not on the course area if other boats are coming in to finish) - you must return completely to the course side of the line before finishing (RRS 44.2) -

I have noticed that in strong wind and big wave Swedish DF sailors will gybe rather than tack.

The tow significant changes on RRS 18 are: - a change to remedy the messy situation set out in WS Case 2. Now when the first of two boats reaches the zone, if the boats are not overlapped the boat that has not reached the zone at that moment shall give the other boat mark room. This is far simpler - first boat in has mark room - a change to RRS 18.3. This is now effectively in 2 parts: i) if a boat passes head to wind from port to starboard in the zone then the RRS 18.2 does not apply between her and another boat on starboard that is fetching the mark. So there is no question of mark room between the two boats and the boat that has just arrived on starboard must comply with 11, 12,13,14,15, 16 and possibly 17 ii) If the boat that was on starboard has been on starboard since entering the zone the the boat that passed head to wind from port to starboard must (in addition to 11, 12,13,14,15, 16 and possibly 17) : shall not cause the other boat to sail above a close-hauled course shall give the other boat mark-room if she becomes overlapped inside Believe it or not this is a significant simplification!

The boat hits the mark while gybing. She is required by RRS 44.2 to get well clear of other boats as soon as possible after the incident. The gybe is part of the incident so it is not part of the penalty. The boat then tacks and there is contact between her and other boats. I would argue that this demonstrates she has failed to get well clear of other boats so she has not started tacking her penalty. Also, as tacking boat (13) or starboard tack boat initially required to give room as she has acquired right of way( 15) or RoW boat changing course (16) she has broken another rule in a separate incident. The boat should take 2 penalty turns for the two infringements. A boat starts taking a penalty when, after getting well clear, she begins to turn to either tack or gybe. From this moment; RRS 21.2 applies and she shall keep clear of boats not taking a penalty. A boat finishes a penalty when she has completed the last tack or the gybe. The rules do not require that the boat turns a full 360° ( in part because there were vexatious protests alleging that the boat had only turned through 350°

The entangled boats were unable, perhaps temporarily, to proceed in the race, so they were disabled. Rule 22 is changed by RRS E1.3(c) to read 'If possible a boay shall avoid a boat that us disabled'. If you could have avoided the entangled boats but did not you broke RRS 22. As for rule 10 (port and starboard) and 11 (windward-leeward) that depends on the exact situation and whether the entangled boats were changing course. If you gained no advantage in the heat (in other words if you place was not better than if you had not broken a rule) then one turn is sufficient.

I am amazed to note that there seems to be entire satisfaction with the current Racing Rules of Sailing!

Neatly put, Darin

John Ball wrote 'My view is that a hail that fails to do it correctly has not hailed at all,' If that is the case then the hailed boat need not respond. Which is not the desired outcome, unless you run a company that rebuilds broken boats! I am not convinced that the rules say that an incorrect hail is a 'no hail' RRS 20.1 says that a boat may hail for room to tack and avoid. It then says that the wording of the hail shall include the sail number of the hailing boat followed by 'Room to tack'. If the hail uses other words then the boat has hailed for room to tack as permitted by RRS 20.1, but the hail itself breaks RRS20.1. However, if the hail breaks RRS20.1 the hailed boat is still required to respond under RRS 20.2(b)

Colin, However, habits picked up early in ones sailing career tend to stick. Which is why is it better to start by using the correct terms. Unfortunately, sometimes WS changes its mind!

Colin, I welcome your support for obliging the hailing boat to state their number. In the confusion of the first beat of a heat there may be several boats coming 'into the wall' who need to tack. And for each boat that hails there may be several boats that will need to respond. In many cases the boat being hailed cannot tack until another boat outside her tacks. World Sailing writes rules for sailing at all levels. The rules are required to work for club sailing, the Olympics and the Fastnet Race. This explains why there is now a default hail for requesting room to tack. At an international event most competitors will not have English as a first language. It is important to formalise and simplify communication so that non-English speakers are not disadvantaged. This is why, for instance, RRS E2.1 Hailing Requirements, stipulates that a sail number shall be hailed 'One Five' and not 'Fifteen' (which can also be confused with 'Fifty'). I was at an international event in Britain where a British competitor announced his intention to tack using words such 'Going about for the wall'. The non-English-speaking competitor outside him had no idea who was hailing or what was being said. The British boat tacked and there was contact. According to the rule the British boat (L in my diagram), has broken rule 20.1, and should take a penalty Rule 20 is a rule of Part 2, E 1.3(b) is a rule of an appendix that changes RRS 20. As a result they can only be changed with the approval of the national authority. I have no issue with club racing not applying this particular rule, if that is agreed However, at higher level events the rule should be applied in full. I would suggest, as a minimum, that the correct hail be required at any event that serves as a selection event for a World, Continental or international championship.

In another thread John 949 wrote: There is an argument that Radio Sailing needs to investigate more specific rules as certain things (like judging overlaps when sailing directly away from the control area) are almost impossible at any distance. The chances of a top down approach working are pretty slim given the bureaucracy and inertia involved. Perhaps clubs could experiment with local rules and hopefully drive any good ideas from the bottom up. To be clear, the RYA has an administrative simple procedure for approving experimental changes to the rules. To counter John's criticism of 'bureaucracy and inertia', as Racing Rules Committee Chair of IRSA, I would be very grateful for any suggestions. If you could identify rules that do not work, that should be changed. May I suggest that, for the moment, we limit our discussion to the rules that govern what happens when boats meet - Part 2 of the Racing Rules of Sailing. For instance: - it is very rare that, as an umpire, I penalise a boat for breaking rule 17, On the same tack, proper course. - RRS 18.3, Tacking in the Zone does not really work in radio sailing. It is difficult to judge, especially as with the relatively stiff sails used in radio sailing it is difficult to judge when a boat is above close hauled. I would be really interested to read your suggestions.

John 949 wrote: There is an argument that Radio Sailing needs to investigate more specific rules as certain things (like judging overlaps when sailing directly away from the control area) are almost impossible at any distance. The chances of a top down approach working are pretty slim given the bureaucracy and inertia involved. Perhaps clubs could experiment with local rules and hopefully drive any good ideas from the bottom up. I presume that John is referring to the rules that apply between boats. These rules are found in Part 2 of the Racing Rules of Sailing. These rules are not rules that can be changed easily. The RYA prescribes that: 86.3 Rule Changes An organizing authority wishing to develop or test alternative racing rules, other than test rules approved by World Sailing, shall obtain prior approval from the RYA. An application form is available from the RYA. The notice of race shall include the approved alternative rules. The organizing authority shall promptly report the results of the development or test to the RYA. Any club, class or the MYA could ask for such approval for events in which they are part of the OA. The question is which rules to change?

There has been a recurring debate concerning the issue of hailing for room to tack under RRS20. The 2025 rules have introduced an obligatory form of words. This raises the question of what happens when the hail does not include the words required by the rules. During my visits to Fleetwood I was impressed by how frequently a hail is required and by the variety of hails that were used. However the rule is now far stricter. I would be interested in reading your comments on this subject. Consider the scenario below: Assumed facts L close-hauled on starboard is approaching the shore and will soon have to tack to avoid it safely. W is to windward and slightly astern of L. L does not have room to tack and avoid W. The competitor controlling L hails but neither hails L’s sail number nor uses the words ‘Room to tack’. What rules apply? Discussion RRS E1.3(b) states : (b) Hails under rules 20.1 and 20.3 shall include the sail number of the hailing boat followed by ‘Room to tack’. RRS 20.2(b) states : A hailed boat shall respond even if the hail breaks rule 20.1. Match Racing Call B3 Answer 1 states: When the umpires are certain that no hail was made, then the signal for room to tack has not been made. The umpires may be certain there was no hail if they have had no difficulty hearing other calls from a similar position. For the purpose of the rules of Part 2 they should act as if there has been no signal. I have removed the rule reference which would now be C2.10). While recognising that MR calls are not authoritative, they can be illustrative and persuasive. In this case I believe that the call shows that in match racing umpires act on the basis that an incorrect hail is not a hail. Any subsequent incident will be judges without reference to RRS20. Questions 1. When sailing under Appendix E, if L’s hail does not include the sail number of L followed by ‘room to tack’: a) Can we consider that no hail been made? In which case does this mean that RRS 20 does not apply and W is not required to respond? b) Can we consider that RRS 20.2(b) applies? Does this mean that W must respond by tacking or hailing 'You Tack' as required by RRS20.2(c). 2. If W is required to respond despite the incorrect hail as in b) above: - can she protest L for the incorrect hail? - if W and L become entangled in this incident, should L be denied any possible redress on the grounds that she was at fault for not hailing correctly?

IRSA Racing Rules Committee had a long discussion on 18.3. The old rule does not really work in radio sailing for many reasons. The new rule does not resolve these issues.There is a simple fix, that I doubt would be acceptable - adopt the High Speed Sailing rule. In this rule at a port hand windward mark the boat arriving on port is entitled to mark room! Having decided that giving mark-room to port tackers would be a step too far we came up with a proposal: Rule 18.3 is changed to: If a boat in the zone of a mark to be left to port passes head to wind from port to starboard tack, she shall give mark-room to a boat that has been both on starboard tack and not subject to rule 13 since entering the zone. When this rule applies between boats, rule 18.2 does not apply between them. The idea is that the port tack boat has a far greater obligation to 'get out of the way of the starboard tacker (with an exception for boats that have tacked onto starboard in the zone). This proposal got put to one side by WS on the grounds that there was a new Rule 18 on the way. I should also point out that any issue is exacerbated when the race committee lays marks too far from the control area. This is especially the case when sailing from right to left ( as seen from the control area) as starboard tackers cannot judge the layline accurately at a distance.

The changes are more a shuffling of the rules that a rewrite. There is a change to RRS 18.3 about tacking in the zone, which applies when both boats tack in the zone.

1. Why not say - A One Turn Penalty is a tack and a gybe or a gybe and a tack. A 2 Turn Penalty is two one turn penalties in the same direction. 2. One of the best way to put people off radio sailing, and to make rule observance very difficult is setting courses too far away from the control area. If competitors cannot read sail numbers easily then the boats are too far away. Using a golf range finder we have found that most sailors cannot read sail numbers beyond a little over 70 metres. RRS E4.3 changes RRS 44.1 Taking a penalty. One change is that the word significant is deleted. If a boat has gained an advantage despite taking a penalty then she should take more penalties until she no longer has an advantage. An advantage is defined as having taken one or more one-turn penalties a boat has gained by her breach a place or places, ir has not lost a place or places that she would have done if she had not broken a rule. An advantage is measured relative to the whole fleet. Call B2 gives an example.

the current Call Book applies. There may be some changes.

Guzzilazz: DF 95 Class Rules state 'Sails are either those supplied by the Licensed Builder, or made to the dimensions and construction as described in Section H, by other manufacturers or individuals. So you can either order direct from Joysway, and the sails will not be measured, or buy/make your own, in which case they will be measured. If Laser/ILCA sails were all the same, why do top sailors spend so much time choosing their sail?

As of 1st January, the new rule book comes into force. The definition of mark-room has been tweaked: Mark -Room Room for a boat (a) to sail to the mark when her proper course is to sail close to it, (b) to round or pass the mark on the required side, and (c) to leave it astern. The paragraph on room to tack has been deleted. A subtle point: mark-room includes a),b) and c). However, they do not necessarily apply in chronological order. In some conditions, particularly when sailing in current, a boat may have left the mark astern but is still rounding or passing it.

James wrote 'However without a GBR representative volunteering to be on the IOMICA technical subcommittee it is hard to put these forward' The same point could be made for IRSA Technical Committee!

Now that World Sailing has not accepted rules changes that would have completely 'changed the game' it would be really useful to identify: - rules and practice that the radio sailing community wishes to maintain; - rules that could, or should, be changed, - issues that need sorting. My belief is that the rules are written for all sailors, and Appendix E is written for all radio sailors. Only if necessary, additional rules (such as umpiring) can be introduced at elite level. Which is why I would be really interested in hearing your thoughts. Gordon

This rule was already in the 2017 rule book.